跟贾陆英老师学《论语》为政篇第五章 2013年12月24日 圣诞快乐！

% h" _& {1 V* q8 s" N3 pmso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: e, l* y: |0 Q9 _& J3 M# Q( y, ]Tahoma;color:#006EFE;mso-font-kerning:0pt">今日圣诞，老猫先祝大家圣诞快乐，虽然是洋人的节日：）下午贾陆英老师继续在老秘网9 I" Y1 i" N( v$ e mso-font-kerning:0pt">QQ* p; ]. [, g' H h& ^ font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:#006EFE;mso-font-kerning:0pt">群“重温经典读书会”49231471辅导我们学习《论语》。贾陆英老师一直记挂着我们这群“大学生”，原本这节课是安排在周三下午的，但贾老师届时另有要事，所以今日上午便特地在群里发出预告，提前到今日下午开课。有此良师，夫复何求？闲话少叙，立即把上课实录整理奉上。" I/ Y8 t8 {3 }- T" C* \4 \ mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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! k) S8 {; H, P4 `/ I4 L: \font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">今天下午，我们学习讨论《论语》为政篇第, D" ^" t! G4 r+ P- p2 z6 r# r, fmso-font-kerning:0pt">5& d- E/ G; ~. C, s. E$ T# ` font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; ! F+ c& I+ T( W$ p2 S1 Tmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">章：, M" e) ^4 X& y mso-font-kerning:0pt">

; ?9 B4 T9 `% k2•5 ' F* r& o6 L9 h0 |6 Z rTahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">孟懿子问孝，子曰：6 L; z6 S; H# C4 c0 p. omso-font-kerning:0pt">“) a) H: r- T* g2 X+ a4 s7 j# O" Amso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">无违。- ?# F* d5 h/ }9 T: M3 z' `* \mso-font-kerning:0pt">”& I' Z7 L- {3 V" emso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">樊迟御，子告之曰：$ o1 D. r/ m% A9 y6 |mso-font-kerning:0pt">“1 b. l _1 K& t+ B- m. ]9 ?mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; 0 @8 Q! b* F6 {/ m8 f* ?- vmso-font-kerning:0pt">孟孙问孝于我，我对曰无违。/ I; j$ j1 @" b$ \7 e, n color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">”( l! h: U; w. u9 s) \3 W' J5 B6 I Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; b. X4 s; Z7 P( T0 Emso-font-kerning:0pt">樊迟曰：4 N7 Y' B# F; h mso-font-kerning:0pt">“4 I5 \. I# o& @mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">何谓也？& d7 ?$ T5 M6 u mso-font-kerning:0pt">”! r5 ^' u; n+ V# P6 _mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; / U1 c# j5 H' N2 J2 g; B. q- ymso-font-kerning:0pt">子曰：" q+ _6 i6 e+ \1 [mso-font-kerning:0pt">“. G$ T. Y* z. c0 X$ b) D mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">生，事之以礼；死，葬之以礼，祭之以礼。8 k9 s! } T, f color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">”

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1 b: o; L9 A2 D5 e3 p Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; " @, _; N$ t8 E0 f7 Bmso-font-kerning:0pt">孟懿子：鲁国大夫，三家之一，姓仲孙，名何忌，懿是谥号。他的父亲孟僖子临死时要他向孔子学礼。无违：不要违背礼。樊迟：孔子的学生，名须，字子迟，比孔子小四十六岁。御：驾驶马车。孟孙：指孟懿子。' s* d- D- o- c5 Tmso-font-kerning:0pt">

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4 |" j; S3 _7 F; F: r- Q) r7 s6 G+ t% V0 D8 | Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">孟懿子请教孔子什么是孝，孔子说：2 o! B- K: ], @1 A+ `10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">“( T: t6 A; Z2 e+ J; Smso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; ; d! s( K2 R+ R) f7 c; qmso-font-kerning:0pt">孝就是不要违背礼。0 Y, q. |* t2 V& D9 [8 m" K, r 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">”: p( X6 w! M, g( ?4 ^7 f' a mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; mso-font-kerning:0pt">一天，樊迟给孔子驾车，孔子告诉他说：' a/ G0 C# z1 z e I& F* X 0pt">"8 E' F' u1 I0 p7 x6 `1 l mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孟孙问我什么是孝，我回答他说不要违背礼。1 M4 t4 f v" m& w5 X mso-font-kerning:0pt">"7 D7 x7 K9 P# |. O. D- ? font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">樊迟说：- O: ]; O+ Y& b. K mso-font-kerning:0pt">" w" i1 Z8 s: D3 A font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">这是什么意思呢& T- ~6 f" s' z% j, gmso-font-kerning:0pt">?" : z7 _) o, O6 k- S* K k }6 w* g font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; + d# R3 Y4 {. E# B& ~! B7 Ymso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孔子说：: p! m; _1 i# k8 X& s mso-font-kerning:0pt">"+ P7 z3 Y, `6 G! b- f font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; . r7 P q1 o* D* L: i3 j1 r0 w7 _) rmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">父母活着的时候，要按礼侍奉他们；父母死了，要按礼来埋葬他们，祭祀他们。- b. X' h: H- S5 J( u# _mso-font-kerning:0pt">"

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; g' d% J: v3 k! ?" |5 J 10.5pt;font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">问：怎样理解孝就是9 N# M9 C5 I1 U M9 H, ^, l 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">“; @; h7 m# H1 g2 S6 M6 s font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; . O; ]. V! w4 o2 l) y. ?: Smso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">无违- _( T: T8 G, ~! E# ~9 _5 F 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">” |3 U: X# c7 g7 N* d0 S) v; ` font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">？- o/ k. x% e0 V( i/ ~5 N. ?10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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0 a- \8 d' Q/ p) Q; U1 N- L& T) ~1 J1 k' ?7 E& H( m p3 v6 cTahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; * z2 P2 I. J6 A0 Cmso-font-kerning:0pt">答：孔子教人是很讲针对性的。孟懿子不能遵从他父亲贤而好礼之教，所以孔子针对他讲得9 G8 p6 h$ G3 a2 W6 G& b9 ^mso-font-kerning:0pt">“* h3 e, J$ D; H7 X! k' r4 y6 `, K font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; 5 W5 |6 g: w% s6 Nmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">无违& ?' \0 l3 F% G/ e1 j) Smso-font-kerning:0pt">”( W0 F" e0 F. B5 k: J) | font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">，就是不要违背父亲的教诲，这是就具体情况所做的回答。但是就普遍事理而言，孔子讲2 A0 A }5 P0 |, R) @. B mso-font-kerning:0pt">“2 g; Q) d' ]$ q6 h4 h' | font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">无违% f R5 {: M0 c& r: \' |mso-font-kerning:0pt">”: W$ z! Y: y% B. V font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">，强调要以礼事亲，不可违背于礼，) N e' k4 D. b# E- E' y; n- u+ c& i mso-font-kerning:0pt">“3 Q$ t$ @" W% I. S! H font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; / V/ z! k9 q zmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">生，事之以礼。死，葬之以礼，祭之以礼。; l' H: t" J. r mso-font-kerning:0pt">”) m. d; ~0 A( T% ?$ ?" A# l font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; ! H: r6 u3 Y" v u. w% J2 qmso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">父母在世，如有不合乎礼的言行，子女是不应当顺从的，而要以合乎礼的方法劝谏，这是对父母真正的爱护、尊敬。孝的精神，还应当体现在父母去世以后，要按照礼制去安葬他们、祭祀他们，这才算子女尽孝有始有终。1 A4 e3 Z9 U, |* H4 V+ i/ z6 c mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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# y$ H) k& B( t% K" l' C y2 j10.5pt;font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; ; p( d. D* k9 p8 n7 imso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">问：为什么说以礼事亲才是孝？' S: o" ?# l/ I* K* _3 r 10.5pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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$ E: ^9 M% Z% u Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black; ' X1 V% e2 h! @mso-font-kerning:0pt">答：本章谈孝的重点是，孝要落实到礼上。孔子讲仁与礼的关系，一方面强调仁是礼的核心，礼应当体现仁的精神；另一方面又强调，礼的规定体现了仁的要求，依礼而行就是仁。据此，是否做到了孝，要以是否依礼而行来衡量。+ ]/ y& U" {+ o) |! W( C' xmso-font-kerning:0pt">

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: v* G4 r9 ^1 |. j6 A9 ~6 |# r. zfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; " ^# y/ F6 z! S X/ |8 U; J& ?mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:#006EFE;mso-font-kerning:0pt">小风飕飕地：3 F6 `# {2 _' J* Gmso-font-kerning:0pt">

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3 ]6 B4 k1 z }* e/ u- m1 D9 q, zmso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: 8 J* x& z0 d% T+ k# q! XTahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孝最重要的是心敬，心敬外化出来的表现是礼遇！反过来说，虽然礼遇有加未必出于心敬，但若是不加礼遇那就一定是心不敬，也就是不孝啦。所以外在的礼对于孝来说很重要，如若无礼那必然是不孝！对父母尽孝道，是义2 V& b- N, G2 V5 ]( pmso-font-kerning:0pt">
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' O1 f7 |; O5 ~" s5 o$ L- ]mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: Tahoma;color:#006EFE;mso-font-kerning:0pt">贾陆英：" B# n' k7 z' h8 O8 a, h- w 0pt">

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' `% u/ f6 J; {% jmso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: 4 D1 o- T& ~5 TTahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孝最重要的是心敬，心敬外化出来的表现是礼遇！: h) t" z- m5 L. u* xmso-font-kerning:0pt">——- E2 q' G# }: Hfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">赞同。孝的本质，是发自内心的对父母的恭敬和感恩之情。有此心，才会有孝行。: K4 r; {3 P% N5 u) Y mso-font-kerning:0pt">

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$ s* U0 q4 @) D) R/ x. Lmso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: # B7 H- I& a$ q- w9 N2 `1 @5 Z# V MTahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">贾老，昨天晚生正好读到战国时期儒家关于礼、丧、祭的论述& {: d5 V1 j+ g3 [9 ^( Emso-font-kerning:0pt">2. S. q* ]' l R- G- nfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">对父母的孝道，是义。如何尽孝，是礼。如何行礼，就是生而不违，去世行丧礼，祭祀行祭礼。对父母的孝，绝对不能行功利主义，现在社会上很多人在父母有能力的时候，和颜悦色，等到父母年迈无力，不能给自己帮上什么了，就放弃赡养父母，这是一种巧言令色，有所图谋。这三点做到都是不简单的，先说不违，能够做到遵循父母的教导，按照父母意愿行事之人有几？晚生做不到，起码现在说，不孝有三无后为大，父母成天逼婚，依旧违背了。老吾老以及人之老啊% i% X! U* m, ]" i/ ?" G, i; a7 a! umso-font-kerning:0pt">

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孝经

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) H, D! o# ?8 t& K' e4 n) b mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma;mso-bidi-font-family: 6 T, I$ S0 m/ ]2 v6 e6 d# vTahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">孝，如今还在于与父母交心、沟通，体谅父母的难处，分担父母的责任。8 A$ L) |3 u8 v* d; }7 F2 j( h mso-font-kerning:0pt">—— A4 A5 C( }- {2 lfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">对，这是从情感上关心父母，是尽孝的重要内容。生，事之以礼。死，葬之以礼，祭之以礼。1 @7 X3 O/ Q. x/ ^# L$ i mso-font-kerning:0pt">——# Y* a6 k/ H2 R( |8 G+ A) bfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; : G8 d7 Y% P/ x+ [& `7 f, _mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">对父母的孝道，是义。如何尽孝，是礼。如何行礼，就是生而不违，去世行丧礼，祭祀行祭礼。《孝经》说：( e( w$ k9 R( ~3 e/ y) @4 z5 Mmso-font-kerning:0pt">“" s7 ?& N+ D, ]) Y font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; 8 L* i9 m' B3 \8 }" e& J! ?mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">礼者，敬而已矣。故敬其父，则子悦；敬其兄，则弟悦；敬其君，则臣悦；敬一人，而千万人悦。所敬者寡，而悦者众，此之谓要道也。1 h' E6 Y* R1 N: V mso-font-kerning:0pt">”; H0 j4 Y) V9 f8 sfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">礼的内在依据是孝悌，而外在表现，就是一个) b# x* k/ R, O' Z; K; K) ymso-font-kerning:0pt">“& K( X/ P! L; r" ?3 z2 ^# W font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">敬" t+ L) p! A0 w$ i" ~2 \0 Y& Ymso-font-kerning:0pt">”9 b$ i4 G6 _7 _8 f5 R font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">字。所以，如能尊敬他的父亲，那么其儿子就会喜悦；如能尊敬他的兄长，那么其弟弟就会喜悦；如能尊敬他的国君，那么其臣下就会喜悦。尊敬的是一个人，却能使千万人喜悦。所敬者虽然只是少数，而喜悦的人却有千千万万，这就是为什么把推行孝悌之道和礼乐教化称为3 k5 z3 h% X) ^" j& Y P5 S! N mso-font-kerning:0pt">“8 C3 ?1 h% x: E( c* J0 @4 @; a2 l' [ font-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">要道8 s1 ^$ h; ^: ]1 E/ }& Gmso-font-kerning:0pt">”2 y9 A! J" Z4 `# g, b* g9 sfont-family:宋体;mso-ascii-font-family:Tahoma;mso-hansi-font-family:Tahoma; mso-bidi-font-family:Tahoma;color:black;mso-font-kerning:0pt">的意义所在啊。* r; O: I" y5 b' _% `4 b% dmso-font-kerning:0pt">

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现在用法律手段规定子女要常回家看看，但是由于时间、金钱等各方面的原因，又有多少人是想回而不能回的呢，这个道德层面的问题上升到法律层面到底有什么意义，始终不大明白

贾老师讲得不错，大家发言很踊跃，尤其那个“小风飕飕地”发言很积极，很好！大家要向他学习！{:soso_e128:}

学习、领会、顿悟、提高，贾老师讲的精彩，大家都很出彩。老秘网我们的共同的平台!

贾老师在研究古人和古汉语方面有研究，佩服

我这里显示也是一堆乱码，怎么回事

好好学习，天天向上{:soso_e195:}

; x: d  X( {7 O; _; j贾老师讲的不错，学习了，谢谢

贾老师讲的不错，学习了，谢谢

我这里显示的是一堆乱码！！

不错，学习了，佩服佩服